Why does Europe suck at startups?
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Maybe this?
If The NSA Isn't Engaged In Economic Espionage, Why Is The USTR Considered 'A Customer' Of Intelligence?
We just had a story about how Australia used its equivalent of the NSA to do economic espionage for the sake of improving trade deals and helping private companies by passing along useful info they…
Revealed: the massive US industrial espionage against France
The United States is conducting widespread economic and industrial espionage against France, including eavesdropping on at least two economy ministers, Mediapart can reveal, as part of its investigat…
They don't say it outright. But what else would an agency wallowing in patriotism like the NSA does do with that data?
Also, they say they don't do it. Which, given the track record of intelligence agencies in general, means they do but haven't been caught yet.
Go ahead, make a snarky remark about tin foil hats. I don't trust any politician or agency anymore.
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The advantages for corporations are big.
Say you want to buy something from me, and you would at most 500 for it. I tell a friend I would sell it for 100. In a normal negotiation, this could sold anywere between 100 and 500 we'll both be satisfied. If someone overheard and told you about my conversation, you will know I would sell for 100, and insist on buying iat exactly 100 or near it.Even more easy, you could get billionaire in the stock market with the information nsa collects.
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Maybe this?
They don't say it outright.
No. Fuck you. You made a claim, back it up.
Of course you can't, because it's a crazy conspiracy theory, as you're now realizing, but. Don't bullshit us about, "well it doesn't say it outright but if you squint and tilt your head..."
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Go ahead, make a snarky remark about tin foil hats. I don't trust any politician or agency anymore.
How do you know when a politician is lying? His lips move.
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Echelon was said to be a crazy conspiracy theory not long ago
My Life Unmasking British Eavesdroppers
Duncan Campbell spent 30 years — and risked his freedom — uncovering the secrets of U.S. and British eavesdropping, including the existence of ECHELON, one of the biggest spy scandals of the Cold War. Now, thanks to Edward Snowden, he has proof of ECHELON's existence.
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AND THEREFORE ALL CRAZY CONSPIRACY THEORIES ARE TRUE!
Good thinking, fbmac.
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And the beauty is: There's nothing I can say that won't sound crazy and/or paranoid to someone who isn't already inclined to believe it.
Until some manager twitters how he got some contract details from an "government official" and then disappears mysteriously. Or something.Carry on, nothing to see here.
Seriously though, how can you be so sure the NSA wouldn't share its data if it deems them pertinent to "American interests"? Because to me that sounds even more crazy than "my" theory.
These guys are used to working in secret, with secret "oversight" noone may talk about, using secret court decisions to justify what they do "for the good of the nation". What should stop them?
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I guess we just have different ideas of what the word "culture" means.
Whenever someone is using the words "America" and "culture" in the same sentence, the first image that comes to my mind is along the lines of this:
[spoiler]
[/spoiler]
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Seriously though, how can you be so sure the NSA wouldn't share its data if it deems them pertinent to "American interests"?
We can't be sure. But it doesn't seem terribly likely given what we know. People who use phrases like:
an agency wallowing in patriotism
...when talking about a country's military don't come across as particularly persuasive or knowledgeable people.
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@cartman82 said:
I guess we just have different ideas of what the word "culture" means.
Whenever someone is using the words "America" and "culture" in the same sentence, the first image that comes to my mind is along the lines of this:
[spoiler][/spoiler]For me it's this:
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coughmiddleeastcough
Yeah, I smirk at how we ripped off all the Iraqis every day when I drive past gas stations selling gas made from stolen Iraqi oil for 20¢ a galloh wait.
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I doubt the entire world could be like that.
Nonsense. The biggest thing is that most countries would have to give up totalitarianism and/or graft, and start treating people with agency. Do that and they would see their economies skyrocket.
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Yeah, there's a gigantic 50' tall neon sign above my head flashing "Citation Needed" here.
I hope you've put in a bunch of solar panels on the roof of your house to produce all that electricity the sign uses.
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So you think noone with access to that info have ever sold any of it to a corporation?
It is impossible to guarantee they arent doing it, and its just too easy and profitable, sorry if I dont believe your politicians are so ethical they wouldn't.
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We can't be sure. But it doesn't seem terribly likely given what we know.
I beg to differ.when talking about a country's military don't come across as particularly persuasive or knowledgeable people.
The NSA is part of your military now?Edit: Of course it is. Sorry.
Also, someone expecting a serious discussion with non-hyperbolic arguments here comes somewhat... suprising.
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One big difference between the U.S. and U.K. culturally and legally is the impact that failure has on an individual.In the U.S. there seems to be a belief (which I'm generally on-board with) that it is possible to learn from a failed idea / failed business. In the U.K. having a controlling interest in a failed business is very much viewed as a black mark - a literal failure.
Also, I'm not sure how the bankruptcy laws work in the U.S. but if an individual is made bankrupt in the U.K. then it can be a veeeeery long climb out of that hole. It's also very unlikely that anyone will lend you money for the next 100 years.Finally, owners of businesses that fail due to mismanagement can be barred from being a director of a company for several years.
So all in all, starting a business in the U.K. carries a significant personal risk and, as a nation of generally risk-averse people, this probably restricts the entrepreneurial pool somewhat.
I don't speak from any experience of starting a business or becoming bankrupt, mainly because I am happy to work hard for someone else and know the paycheck will be in the bank each month!
I wonder if these are parts of the difference between governments that started as replublics/democracies and those that started as monarchies?
A good friend is a corporate lawyer and general counsel for a Fortune 500 company. They until recently did a lot of business overseas and most of the differences he had to deal with in regards to their law and licensing could be traced directly back to origination as a monarchy.
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Okay. Why don't you think it likely, given their mission, their resources and their self-image?
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Not all of them! Look, see, we have exported our genderism bullshit to Tennessee. You're welcome.
The University of Tennessee at Knoxville drew widespread derision last week for publishing a pronoun usage guide that asked students and professors to add the gender-neutral descriptors ze/zir/zirs and xe/xem/xyrs to their vocabularies.
I would just refer to my trans-students as "The Unpronouncables", just to make a point.
I would also polish my resume, because I would soon need it.
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Whenever someone is using the words "America" and "culture" in the same sentence, the first image that comes to my mind is along the lines of this:
Little dots represent diversity? Scientific prowess? What?
For me it's this:
Bait for @blakeyrat?
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Okay. Why don't you think it likely, given their mission, their resources and their self-image?
Their mission is to spy on other countries for defense purposes. This doesn't sound too much like that. They are very jealous of the information they have and one reason not to let it out of the bag is to reveal their sources and methods, which are typically the holiest of holies for an intelligence agency.
I couldn't say that someone in the chain of command with otherwise legitimate access to information couldn't use it for some economic purpose or talk to certain parties about the information, but I don't see any good evidence that there's some institutional policy on sharing information like that with the private sector.
My perception of American trade negotiations is that political concerns overwhelm just about anything an intelligence agency could pull up. Not to mention the amount of information available via open sources. To be able to distill the volume of automated collection from that stuff, when their main focus is elsewhere strikes me as unlikely.
OTOH, tapping EADS' phones and email to understand exactly where the materiel is going (and that's a lot more important now that Iran sanctions are going away) is right in their lane.
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Data is collected, and is very valuable for economic purposes. They can get away with it.
Governments and politicians dont do things out of the goodness on their hearts.
I dont need any more proof to assume they do it.
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I would also polish my resume, because I would soon need it.
It would be funnier if you waited to start doing the previous sentence until after you had tenure.
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Their mission is to spy on other countries for defense purposes. This doesn't sound too much like that.
But what does "defense" include? Can gaining an economical advantage be part of a nation's defense? I would say so.@Snowden said:
I don’t want to preempt the editorial decisions of journalists, but what I will say is there’s no question that the US is engaged in economic spying. If there is information at Siemens that they think would be beneficial to the national interests – not the national security – of the United States, they’ll go after that information and they’ll take it.
https://edwardsnowden.com/de/2014/01/27/video-ard-interview-with-edward-snowden/I couldn't say that someone in the chain of command with otherwise legitimate access to information couldn't use it for some economic purpose or talk to certain parties about the information, but I don't see any good evidence that there's some institutional policy on sharing information like that with the private sector.
No good evidence, agreed. But why let that nice data go to waste if your nation could profit from it? I'm just trying to put myself into their position. And I definitely would try to make some use from things I already have and know. Kinda hard to resist that temptation.
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I dont need any more proof to assume they do it.
Just don't fool yourself that you're doing anything but making assumptions. And don't be surprised when others don't share them.
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We do assumptions all the time. We can't understand and know everything with absolute precision. My best guess is that they do use this information, and they shouldn't expect trust after collecting it.
Now, about others not sharing it, it's ok. I think the trust they put in their system is another big advantage they have. People are much better when they trust they are in a fair or at least reasonable system.
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Just don't fool yourself that you're doing anything but making assumptions. And don't be surprised when others don't share them.
But...he has a feeling. Just like I have a feeling he needs a tinfoil hat.
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@cartman82 said:
Although, an Englishman DID invent the word "meme", so that's something.
And the web.
And Wiff-Waff.
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@dkf said:
@cartman82 said:
Although, an Englishman DID invent the word "meme", so that's something.
And the web.
And Wiff-Waff.
And Boiled Beef.
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So you think noone with access to that info have ever sold any of it to a corporation?
I think there's no evidence that that has occurred.
It is impossible to guarantee they arent doing it,
That reasoning can be applied to literally anything.
sorry if I dont believe your politicians are so ethical they wouldn't.
The NSA doesn't employ politicians.
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The NSA doesn't employ politicians.
No, but they are probably blackmailing a few of them.
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@flabdablet said:
I'm pretty sure that was appropated from the Irish. Just putting the fucking boot in once again.@dkf said:
@cartman82 said:
Although, an Englishman DID invent the word "meme", so that's something.
And the web.
And Wiff-Waff.
And Boiled Beef.
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Why do you hate Irish people so much?
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They exist.
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At least you give an honest answer.
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I thought the same thing.
This is why Wikipedia has the best editorial staff ever, they really have their shit together when it comes to proofreading.
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It makes sense on the page, but not in the onebox.
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Why are all major recent inventions from the US? I'll give you a selection of options:
[poll]
- The illuminati are centered in the US, and boost local innovation
- The illuminati are centered in Europe, and suppress local innovation/co-opt local talent to draw attention away from themselves
- Confirmation bias
- They actually aren't.
[/poll]
Adding in a random google result: http://www.eupedia.com/europe/list_of_inventions_by_country.shtml
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as a nation of generally risk-averse people
Yeah, Europeans are very risk adverse.
They made their government do all the risk management.It's no wonder they don't have innovations any more.
It's all America and Japan.
Donald Trump
is making mistakes with a legacy.
That's not success. That's having a wide risk net.
And then, there's bureaucracy, social programs, labor-friendly laws etc.
Then why are we striving to be like Europe.
It's like, you're watching it burn and saying, I want to stand in that fire.
IOW, at one time America was a WoW Tank, taking risks, dodging fire, keeping aggro.
Now it's like a WoW DPS, standing in fire, throwing damage (money) at problems and hoping enough people like your dps (rhetoric) levels.But, no matter what.
We need to all wake up and realize that the healer (money/banks/economy) has been OOM for decades.
Where as in Europe you have a uk company that is developing for the uk which
doesn't matter, because success is measured with respect to the market (domain).
You understand that English is the predominant language in the U.K., right?
I wonder what studio produced the original content of that image?
We have to put American cartoons in our memes because otherwise Americans won't understand them.
Nice try.
If we invented bent-over-laughing-so-hard, then that explains why you guys are so dull.
To say that culture flows from the U.S. to these places is nonsense. The U.S. has inherited (and continues to inherit) much of its culture from overseas.
I think he meant modern culture. Which would be true, especially for eastern countries.
You guys need to get over your 200+ year old culture. If I needed that much old culture, I'd just import it from China, they do a way better job on ancient culture.
A lot less "BURN THIS SHIT DOWN" every time a new culture won control.
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No, but they are probably blackmailing a few of them.
Not directly. They probably pass the appropriate information on to other politicians and let them to the blackmailing. :P
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They probably pass the appropriate information on to
other politiciansstrong textAmerican Corporations and let them to the blackmailing.TFHTFY
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Where as in Europe you have a uk company that is developing for the uk which
doesn't matter, because success is measured with respect to the market (domain).
So a German IVR company is going to compete in the American and Japanese IVR markets? Explain.
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That sounds less aneurysm inducing.
The IVR company we outsource too wouldn't handle our German operation for some reason. We had to find a local one who by strange coincidence wouldn't handle our English end giving someone whom I actually dislike a lot of headaches.
Another happy ending.
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I thought it was common knowledge that the NSA is endulging in oversharing?
... how? The NSA doesn't share the data they collect with anybody; hell, for years they didn't even share the fact that they were capable of collecting the data.
Contrast this with
More Surveillance Abuse Exposed! Special DEA Unit Is Spying On Americans And Covering It Up
As Americans sort through their feelings regarding the disclosure of the massive collection of metadata by the National Security Administration, we are now learning of what may be a far more insidious violation of our constitutional rights at the hands of a government agency. English: The seal of...
Here we are, forbes.com peddling conspiracy theories again.
You've been listening to the conspiracy theorists here, I think.
Solid conspiracy theories. The NSA is already passing underhanded tips to the FBI. If a lowly FBI cop gets tips from the NSA as part of a government program, so will friends of congress. You'd need extraordinary evidence to convince me otherwise. And that's before we even get to individuals. You think Snowden was the only guy stealing information? The other guys doing it just don't share his ethics so we don't hear about it.
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Here we are, forbes.com peddling conspiracy theories again.
The unit of the DEA that is conducting the surveillance is known as the Special Operations Division (“SOD”) and is made up of a partnership of numerous government agencies including the NSA, CIA, FBI, IRS and the Department of Homeland Security.
Did some of those guys stop being government agencies and turn into private companies when I wasn't watching?
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The kid was warned multiple times that the device was suspicious, which is what most of the articles carelessly leave out.
That's because it didn't happen.
He had ONE teacher tell him he "should probably keep it in his backpack". Nobody told him the device was suspicious. Nobody told him he'd be arrested if it made a beeping noise in English class.
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Here we are, forbes.com peddling conspiracy theories again.
The DEA is not the NSA. It's obvious, but I guess I have to type it because you're a retard.
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@gleemonk said:
Here we are, forbes.com peddling conspiracy theories again.
The DEA is not the NSA. It's obvious, but I guess I have to type it because you're a retard.
Did you even attempt to skim the article? I quote from the top:
The unit of the DEA that is conducting the surveillance is known as the Special Operations Division (“SOD”) and is made up of a partnership of numerous government agencies including the NSA, CIA, FBI, IRS and the Department of Homeland Security.
And before you go on saying that this is no evidence the NSA is sharing their data, read a bit further.
Boiled beef - Wikipedia
