Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy
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That button at the end of every thread. "Watch".
I don't know what it does. If I click it it says "You will get notifications from this thread". But I already do. And now there's a giant orange scary "Unwatch" button.
Maybe I don't want this thread to be special. So I click "Unwatch" and now it says "You will not receive notifications from this thread". But wait I do want notifications. Did I just unsubscribe? But I was subscribed to this thread. How do I get it back?
Maybe if I hover over the button it will tell me what the fuck it does. Nope, of course not, tooltips are for foolz!
What does it do? What state am I even in at this point? Am I watching it or not? If the default is "I get notifications" and it is blue with an eye, does that mean that now that I've clicked "Unwatch" and it is blue with an eye I am watching it again?
WHY HAVE THE NODEBB DEVS MIXED UP THE ACTION AND THE STATE UI? Does this button's UI reflect the state I'm in, or the state I will be in if I click the button.
Like-- if this were another site, and there was a button that said "Click here to receive emails", and I clicked it-- and then it turned into a huge red warning that said "STOP RECEIVING EMAILS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!", and that was on every page-- it might make me think I'm in a negative state rather than a positive state.
Fuck the UI/UX here sucks.
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@Lorne-Kates said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
That button at the end of every thread. "Watch".
I don't know what it does. If I click it it says "You will get notifications from this thread". But I already do.Getting notifications from "the thread" should mean you'll be notified every time someone posts in it. You are "watching" it. If you're not watching, you don't get notified for new posts. You get notified for upvotes to your posts and if someone mentions you, but that's the default level of notification. Clicking "unwatch" takes you back to that level.
Yes, the UI is confusing. Especially so because the button's label says what you're not doing. It's been bikeshedded to hell and back in @boomzilla's thread about adding the "ignore" option.
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@Lorne-Kates said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
If I click it it says "You will get notifications from this thread". But I already do.
Um, what? How do you get notifications from a thread if you aren't watching it? I only get notifications from direct mentions unless I watch a thread for replies.
@anotherusername said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
Yes, the UI is confusing. Especially so because the button's label says what you're not doing.
Pretty much every website I have used works this way in some form or fashion. It's a pretty common UI trope.
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@LB_ said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
Pretty much every website I have used works this way in some form or fashion. It's a pretty common UI trope.
It's retarded, don't defend it.
We have this thing called a "checkbox control" which is perfect for communicating two states in a clear fashion. It was invented back in 1983 so you know it's pretty cutting edge.
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@anotherusername said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
Yes, the UI is confusing. Especially so because the button's label says what you're not doing. It's been bikeshedded to hell and back in @boomzilla's thread about adding the "ignore" option.
Yeah, I literally cannot understand how my changes make things less intuitive for new users. For old users used to the old way? OK, there's something changing there. But I expanded, using my words, on what the various states do. I just also added one.
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@LB_ said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
Pretty much every website I have used works this way in some form or fashion. It's a pretty common UI trope.
For a button which performs an action, then describing the action is fine. But for a button which also displays the current state, describing the other state is confusing, even if clicking it takes you to the other state. It's not like there aren't ways to display multiple options and at the same time clearly indicate which of them is currently active:
Even when a widget does say the action you'll perform by clicking, it should also display the current state to clear the confusion.
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@LB_ said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
How do you get notifications from a thread if you aren't watching it?
I dunno. I guess I automatically watch a thread I've posted to. Except the "Watch" button is still in the blue "You are not watching this thread" state.
Also if someone mentions me in a thread I haven't posted to or watched, I still get a notification.
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@anotherusername said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
But for a button which also displays the current state, describing the other state is confusing, even if clicking it takes you to the other state.
I really don't get what's confusing about it. (leaving aside the unrelated watch/ignore confusion, which probably stems from the naively worded toaster message)
You have a button that does what it says when you click on it. Once clicked, it's replaced by a button that also does what it says on it when clicked.
The button does not and is not meant to describe the current 'watched' state of the thread - it's a button, not a checkbox.
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@Lorne-Kates said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
. I guess I automatically watch a thread I've posted to.
For "watch" read "notificationspam"
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@Lorne-Kates said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
I guess I automatically watch a thread I've posted to. Except the "Watch" button is still in the blue "You are not watching this thread" state.
That's a bug, then.
@anotherusername @blakeyrat alright, I'm wrong. I agree with you. (Really.)
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@boomzilla said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
Yeah, I literally cannot understand how my changes make things less intuitive for new users.
That's because you're shit at UI.
Yeah, that's harsh, but don't take it badly. I'm shit at UI as well, and I suspect 90% of the people here are. Certainly all the people who have contributed to chodeBB's UI are pretty atrocious at it. It's fucking awful. When even Discourse is better than you are, you are riding the crest of the fail wave.
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@tufty said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
That's because you're shit at UI.
I don't deny that, but it also doesn't mean I'm wrong in this case. Can you make the case that I am wrong about that and that my changes would confuse a new user more than what we have?
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@boomzilla No, biut I could probably make a case that they won't confuse a new user less.
Frankly, before changing UI around in a functional manner, there's an awful lot of far more fucking urgent donkey work to be done. The absolute first thing to do if you want to make this sack of donkey excrement noticeably better would be to add tooltips to the existing UI elements.
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@boomzilla I say they've already filled the product with shit UI, it's kind of late to start caring about it now.
Make a deal. Say you'll work on fixing your UI if they work on fixing one of their particularly atrocious bits.
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@tufty said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
No, biut I could probably make a case that they won't confuse a new user less.
Probably, but not the accusation at hand.
@tufty said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
The absolute first thing to do if you want to make this sack of donkey excrement noticeably better would be to add tooltips to the existing UI elements.
To be fair, it wasn't just monkeying around with UI for the hell of it. The point was to add functionality so that people could ignore individual threads, which a lot of people here want.
Also, now you're going to piss off the pendants who are going to complain that touch interfaces can't use tooltips, so thanks for that.
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@blakeyrat said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
Say you'll work on fixing your UI if they work on fixing one of their particularly atrocious bits.
That sounds like a fun way to get nothing accepted.
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@boomzilla said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
@blakeyrat said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
Say you'll work on fixing your UI if they work on fixing one of their particularly atrocious bits.
That sounds like a fun way to get nothing accepted.
i think that's his point really.
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@boomzilla said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
That sounds like a fun way to get nothing accepted.
And I was 100% serious and not joking when I proposed it.
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@boomzilla said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
To be fair, it wasn't just monkeying around with UI for the hell of it. The point was to add functionality so that people could ignore individual threads, which a lot of people here want.
Sure. But adding functionality is, at least to me, seriously secondary to making sure the functionality you already have, y'know, works.
complain that touch interfaces can't use tooltips
People who expect to be able to use touch interfaces for anything other than fingerpainting are drooling retards. Fuck 'em.
so thanks for that.
you're welcome.
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@boomzilla said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
Also, now you're going to piss off the pendants who are going to complain that touch interfaces can't use tooltips, so thanks for that
Actually. they do work on non clickable elements. On android. if I tap the upvote count it shows up the same as hovering on desktop
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@Jaloopa said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
if I tap the upvote count
If it weren't for our style customizations, you wouldn't be able to tap that number (in general, it was still possible but much more difficult without accidentally voting).
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@tufty said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
People who expect to be able to use touch interfaces for anything other than fingerpainting are drooling retards. Fuck 'em.
That's a great attitude to have.
:attaboy.csvm:
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@tufty said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
Sure. But adding functionality is, at least to me, seriously secondary to making sure the functionality you already have, y'know, works.
Personally, I'll probably never ignore a thread, but a lot of people want that.
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@boomzilla said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
Can you make the case that I am wrong about that and that my changes would confuse a new user more than what we have?
Have you tried proposing the same over on community.nope but with the earlier pre-bikeshed wording? See if they understand that better?
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How about some text saying 'You'll get notifications from this thread' with a separate-but-obviously-related button next to it which says 'change...' which, when clicked, opens a menu with all the options and their explanations.
Or a slider above/below the text that does the same job. Slide it and the text updates to whatever the current state is.
Too old-fashioned?
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@boomzilla said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
Personally, I'll probably never ignore a thread, but a lot of people want that.
You're kind of a MOD so you can't really.
I'm not and I hate everybody so I need to.
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@boomzilla said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
Also, now you're going to piss off the pendants who are going to complain that touch interfaces can't use tooltips, so thanks for that.
Let's all sing along...
Tooltips are used to enhance UI,
They aren't the only hammer in the box,
UX cues can be related to the user,
Through position, color, and size, too It rhymes in the original Canadian.
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@sloosecannon said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
That's a great attitude to have.
Yes, it is. If more people had it, computing would be better.
Would I be correct in guessing you are a touch interface user?
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@tufty said in Moar NodeBB undocumented confusing UI idiocy:
Would I be correct in guessing you are a touch interface user?
You would.
Touch interfaces are very usable. They're different, but they're very usable.
Unless someone with an attitude like yours makes an application intentionally unusable of course.......
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The question was rhetorical.
I could see the drool on your post.
