Mashup Challenge $100,000 prize - WTF if Spectate Swamp wins?



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    I know teachers and principals. That are dumber than me. So what.

    I bet they could form.  Sentences correctly.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    Years back at a Systematix Christmas party I was seated with 2 other new staff and their wives. They were University Computing profs. Both were very nervous about their upcomming assignments. They should have been. There is no way they could touch me with 15 years of consulting along with another 8 in Data Processing. Couldn't touch dumb old SpectateSwamp.

     

    Do you have anything to back this statement up, or are you just being arrogant again?

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    Point #2 on the Degreeds and their stupidness. From a reliable source (a guy at the stores wicket). A new technical supervisor insisted that those doing the pulp testing, have tech degrees. Replacing and moving those aside that were not so well degreed. The new techies took way longer doing their tests than the oldtimers. The old group would grab a pinch of pulp between their fingers and roll it around. The techies would get some and run to their lab. Comming back with results 15 minutes later.

    I think I see what you're trying to say here, but I think you're being a bit presumptuous.  What sort of tests were they running?  Was a simple by-feel test enough to produce the same results as a lab test?  How is running a lab test necessarily a sign of stupidity?

    @SpectateSwamp said:


    The Degreeds discriminate against the rest of us.

    No, just you. 



  • @bstorer said:

    Stay away from teachers.  They don't need you bothering them.  On the whole, they're some of the hardest-working and under-appreciated people out there.  My wife kills herself for ten hours a day, the last thing she needs is you running your idiot mouth about education.  I, however, have ample time to systematically mock your moronic theories.
     

    QFT!! (Thank you!)

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    They were University Computing profs. Both were very nervous about their upcomming assignments. They should have been. There is no way they could touch me with 15 years of consulting along with another 8 in Data Processing. Couldn't touch dumb old SpectateSwamp.

    I'm sure

    1. they wouldn't have touched you even if you'd paid them
    2. they would have easily beat you when I came to programming and programming techniques
    3. that they just kept silent because they couldn't believe you were serious about the bullshit you were talking
    4. that when they told you so, you just went: "Oh - criticism? You don't. Get what I. Am saying. Geeks! Stupid! Degrees! Booo!! Boondoggle - Jam It? Random Noodle. Desktop Search!!"
    Well - I do have a CS univ. degree. I'd beat you in any CS related field. With our without a degree...



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

     Poor poor old Spectate and his dumb friends want some of that Dino Cash$$$$
     

    If you'd been wise (not smart) when you were a kid, you would've gotten a better education , so you could have a better job and more money.  That way you wouldn't be here whining about the "Dino Cash" that you somehow think you are entitled to.

     @SpectateSwamp said:

    Point #2 on the Degreeds and their stupidness. From a reliable source (a guy at the stores wicket). A new technical supervisor insisted that those doing the pulp testing, have tech degrees. Replacing and moving those aside that were not so well degreed. The new techies took way longer doing their tests than the oldtimers. The old group would grab a pinch of pulp between their fingers and roll it around. The techies would get some and run to their lab. Comming back with results 15 minutes later.

     

    I'm confused here.  I thought you said it was good to be stupid?  You keep calling yourself dumb.  So I guess you are stupid in a "good way" and the "Degreeds" are stupid in a "bad way"?

    Moving right along, nobody is denying that experience and common sense often trump book learning.   But you know what, sometimes common sense just isn't enough.  Common sense alone would not have produced your camcorder, the Internet, Visual Basic, your laptop, and your truck.  The problem is that complicated machines require math and science created by centuries of learning and discovery.  Book learning allows you to take advantage of the centuries of hard work and discovery of very smart men and women.  Common sense only allows you to take advantage of what you personally learned in your lifetime.  If you only use common sense, you will be forever reinventing the wheel.  I don't think anyone is smart enough to reinvent your laptop, for example, from scratch, without any prior knowledge of electronics, manufacturing, etc.

    You hate smart people so much - next time you have an illness or you need surgery, don't go to a doctor with a medical degree.  Go to a "faith healer" or medicine man like yourself.  If you are in a car accident and need life-saving surgery, I somehow don't think you'll be hating on "Degreed" medical doctors at that point in your life.

     



  • Sorry, I forgot:

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    I know teachers and principals. That are dumber than me. So what.
     

    I know dogs that are smarter than you. So what.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    I was seated with 2 other new staff and their wives. They were University Computing profs. Both were very nervous about their upcomming assignments.

    The more I think about it the clearer a picture of the party forms in my head. Theres Swamp, seated with these profs. Here's the conversation:

     

    Prof 1 (to Prof 2): Remember when our database lookups were so slow?
    Swamp (thinks):
    Database? Lookup?? WTF??? Text file! Indexing slow!
    Prof 1 (to Prof 2):
    We did this query optimization, added another index field and now it is lightning fast!
    Swamp:
    I wrote. This database once. All in one text file! Run Desktop Search. Enter Enter Enter. Much faster than indexers. Put a noodle in and Jam It!
    Prof 2:
    Oh... yeah... right...
    Swamp (thinks):
    They just. Can't touch me. Desktop Search Expert. Random! Curses!

     

    Now THAT should be turned into an MFD comic!



  • I find it utterly astounding how you can be so wrong about everything.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    know teachers and principals. That are dumber than me. So what. 2 examples. Years back at a Systematix Christmas party I was seated with 2 other new staff and their wives. They were University Computing profs.
    News flash, idiot: university professors are not teachers or principals.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    Both were very nervous about their upcomming assignments. They should have been. There is no way they could touch me with 15 years of consulting along with another 8 in Data Processing.  Couldn't touch dumb old SpectateSwamp.
      Couldn't touch you in what, writing dreadful, mind-numbingly bad programs?

     @SpectateSwamp said:

    Point #2
      That would require a Point #1.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    From a reliable source (a guy at the stores wicket).
    I'm not clear on what a "stores wicket" is, so I'll just assume he works in the cricket section of a SportChek, or something.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    new technical supervisor insisted that those doing the pulp testing, have tech degrees. Replacing and moving those aside that were not so well degreed. The new techies took way longer doing their tests than the oldtimers. The old group would grab a pinch of pulp between their fingers and roll it around. The techies would get some and run to their lab. Comming back with results 15 minutes later.
      Not knowing anything about wood pulp, I can't say whether this is overkill or not.  In some situations, one would want a more scientific method.  But on the other hand, in the US, OSHA's soil classification system includes numerous manual tests, including rolling a ball of soil into a thin thread to test plasticity (If interested, see here.  Look for "Manual tests" near the bottom).  So who knows?

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    The Degreeds discriminate against the rest of us. Time for a little truth on the matter.
       My father is a big proponent of the theory that it's not the degree that matters, but that you put forth the effort to get the degree that matters.  Worth considering.



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    Point #2 on the Degreeds and their stupidness. From a reliable source (a guy at the stores wicket). A new technical supervisor insisted that those doing the pulp testing, have tech degrees. Replacing and moving those aside that were not so well degreed. The new techies took way longer doing their tests than the oldtimers. The old group would grab a pinch of pulp between their fingers and roll it around. The techies would get some and run to their lab. Comming back with results 15 minutes later.


     

     Couple of examples of the failure of common sense:

    • Common sense tells experienced computer operators like you and me that keyboard shortcuts are faster than using the mouse.  However, scientific research shows that using the mouse is usually faster.  So software developers continue to focus on mouse interfaces
    • Hundreds of years ago, common sense told doctors that the best way cure sickness was to bleed it out with leeches.  Scientific research found this was not so.
    • Common sense told the ancient Greeks that an object will only move when you push it;once you stop pushing it, it will stop moving.  Scientific research tells us that in the absence of friction, an object will keep moving forever, even though nobody is pushing it
    • Common sense told people that heavier objects fall faster.  Scientific research taught us that, taking away the effects of air resistance, light objects fall just as fast as heavy objects
    • Common sense told people that man will never fly
    • Common sense told people that nobody needs a computer in their house

    And it was not just dumb people who believed these common nuggets of wisdom.  It was also smart people, very educated people and successful businessmen.  Without education and book learning, we'd just be making the same errors over and over again throughout history.  Education allows the human race as a whole to move forward.

    The issue here is not "dumb versus smart" people.  The issue that some people are willing to learn and work hard, and others are so arrogant that they sneer at the free education and book learning the government provides for them.  They spit in the face of all the opportunities that are handed on a silver platter.  "I don't need no fancy-book learning!" they cry.  "Nobody needs more than Grade 8/9!"



  • @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    @bstorer said:

    @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    Sound on track? Anybody have an idea for the favicon yet? 
    Well, there's always good ol' swampy.


     

    Consider it done. If anyone has anything better, let me know.

    I think the white on the lower-right better be replaced by transparency, looks better on a non-white background (IMHO). Something like [url]http://rapidshare.de/files/39048852/favicon-new.ico.html[/url].

    Also please consider making the XHTML valid, especially since it's not far away. You will need to add the alt attribute to the picture on the main page, turn all <br>s into <br />s, take the TABLE out of P and remove the extraneous </ul>s and </div>s. Remember, bad markup is bad for your liver.

    P.S. Why is there all the doPostback JS cruft when there's no forms on the site, anywhere? And, more importantly, why is the layout fixed-width?



  • @CodeSimian said:

    Common sense tells experienced computer operators like you and me that keyboard shortcuts are faster than using the mouse.  However, scientific research shows that using the mouse is usually faster.  So software developers continue to focus on mouse interfaces
    Not to derail things, but in my experience, it's not that using keyboard shortcuts is faster, it's switching from keyboard to mouse and back that's a problem.



  • @bstorer said:

    @CodeSimian said:

    Common sense tells experienced computer operators like you and me that keyboard shortcuts are faster than using the mouse.  However, scientific research shows that using the mouse is usually faster.  So software developers continue to focus on mouse interfaces
    Not to derail things, but in my experience, it's not that using keyboard shortcuts is faster, it's switching from keyboard to mouse and back that's a problem.

     

    I agree completely.  But now the new "common wisdom" is that keyboard shortcuts should be 2nd-class citizens, unfortunately.  The real problem is only 5% of people are willing or able to invest the time to learn all those shortcuts.  This is probably why Windows XP and higher hides shortcuts by default until you press ALT.  



  • @CodeSimian said:

    @bstorer said:

    @CodeSimian said:

    Common sense tells experienced computer operators like you and me that keyboard shortcuts are faster than using the mouse.  However, scientific research shows that using the mouse is usually faster.  So software developers continue to focus on mouse interfaces
    Not to derail things, but in my experience, it's not that using keyboard shortcuts is faster, it's switching from keyboard to mouse and back that's a problem.
     

    I agree completely.  But now the new "common wisdom" is that keyboard shortcuts should be 2nd-class citizens, unfortunately.  The real problem is only 5% of people are willing or able to invest the time to learn all those shortcuts.  This is probably why Windows XP and higher hides shortcuts by default until you press ALT.

     

    They can have my C-x C-c when they pry it from my cold, dead hands! 



  • @Spectre said:

    Also please consider making the XHTML valid
     

    No.

    Why? Because I don't care. As I go over various things on the site, I try to make it nicer, but I am not going to take time to do stupid, pedantic crap when I could be putting up more content for amusement. If you have time to do this kind of stuff, then by all means, please volunteer your time and help out.

    @Spectre said:

    P.S. Why is there all the doPostback JS cruft when there's no forms on the site, anywhere?

     The only JS stuff on the site is the google analytics. Anything else could only be explained by ASP.NET framework stuff still appearing. I doubt that though. 

     @Spectre said:

    And, more importantly, why is the layout fixed-width?

    I cannot figure out how that is important at all, least of all 'most important' but feel free to volunteer your time to improve the site's aesthetics.

     

    P.S. Why does it matter? Really?



  • @bstorer said:

    @CodeSimian said:

    @bstorer said:

    @CodeSimian said:

    Common sense tells experienced computer operators like you and me that keyboard shortcuts are faster than using the mouse.  However, scientific research shows that using the mouse is usually faster.  So software developers continue to focus on mouse interfaces
    Not to derail things, but in my experience, it's not that using keyboard shortcuts is faster, it's switching from keyboard to mouse and back that's a problem.
     

    I agree completely.  But now the new "common wisdom" is that keyboard shortcuts should be 2nd-class citizens, unfortunately.  The real problem is only 5% of people are willing or able to invest the time to learn all those shortcuts.  This is probably why Windows XP and higher hides shortcuts by default until you press ALT.

     

    They can have my C-x C-c when they pry it from my cold, dead hands! 

     

    Of course, when I wrote "This is probably why Windows XP and higher hides shortcuts by default until you press ALT", I should've written "menu shortcuts".

    Notice that a lot of keyboards these days have the standard Windows shortcuts right on the front of the keys, along with some symbol that indicates you need to press CTRL to activate them. 



  •  We have a new entry for the favicon. Waco.Huber sent me one, it is more of an animated-swamp. 

    What is the consensus?

      or ?



  • @CodeSimian said:

    ...   But you know what, sometimes common sense just isn't enough.  Common sense alone would not have produced your camcorder, the Internet, Visual Basic, your laptop, and your truck. ...
     

    you seem to be forgetting that our lil' friend swampy's  sense ain't exactly "common".-



  • @ZippoLag said:

    @CodeSimian said:

    ...   But you know what, sometimes common sense just isn't enough.  Common sense alone would not have produced your camcorder, the Internet, Visual Basic, your laptop, and your truck. ...
     

    you seem to be forgetting that our lil' friend swampy's  sense ain't exactly "common".-

     

    In all seriousness. it doesn't matter.  His argument is "Common sense good, book learning bad."   I am trying to show him that sometimes you need book learning, like it or not.  



  • @CodeSimian said:

    I am trying to show him
     

    And there is your problem.



  • Keypunch Verify for keyboard speed.

    @CodeSimian said:

    Common sense tells experienced computer operators like you and me that keyboard shortcuts are faster than using the mouse.  However, scientific research shows that using the mouse is usually faster.  So software developers continue to focus on mouse interfaces

    BS. If you use the keyboard properly it is way faster than any mouse. I'm not talking Ctrl/Alt anything (those keys might just as well be hanging on the wall) having to move you hand from the home position slows you down, big time.. How about jj (enter) for example I can do that way quicker than moving my hand to any mouse. and I can do it while watching TV. If you have never done a keypunch verify program, then you don't know anything about keyboard speed. Nothing nada zilch zero....


  • Smart Dog - dumb people

    @tdittmar said:

    I know dogs that are smarter than you. So what.
    That dog must have been "Jim the wonderdog". He was smarter than all of us here. I'm sure this group will explain him away somehow.



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    @CodeSimian said:

    Common sense tells experienced computer operators like you and me that keyboard shortcuts are faster than using the mouse.  However, scientific research shows that using the mouse is usually faster.  So software developers continue to focus on mouse interfaces

    BS. If you use the keyboard properly it is way faster than any mouse. I'm not talking Ctrl/Alt anything (those keys might just as well be hanging on the wall) having to move you hand from the home position slows you down, big time.. How about jj (enter) for example I can do that way quicker than moving my hand to any mouse. and I can do it while watching TV. If you have never done a keypunch verify program, then you don't know anything about keyboard speed. Nothing nada zilch zero....

     

    I don't see what the fuzz is all about, I always keep my right hand on the mouse, my left on teh left side of the kb and my center hand in the right side of the keyboard, that way I can do all sorts of h4xx0r stuff really fast, and without even having to look at the screen, since, you know, I've replaced the Ctrl and Alt keys for some special non-sighted-people-accesability-interface that we developed back in highschool, I just put my thumbs over them and I know exactly whats going on. So YOU my friend, don't know anything about any kind of speed.-

    PS: No uses una palabra de un idioma -por ejemplo "nada"- si no sabes hablarlo. 



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    BS. If you use the keyboard properly it is way faster than any mouse. I'm not talking Ctrl/Alt anything (those keys might just as well be hanging on the wall) having to move you hand from the home position slows you down, big time.. How about jj (enter) for example I can do that way quicker than moving my hand to any mouse. and I can do it while watching TV. If you have never done a keypunch verify program, then you don't know anything about keyboard speed. Nothing nada zilch zero....
     

    Yes, Spectate, BUT THE MASSES DON'T WANT TO LEARN KEYBOARD SHORTCUTS.  For the most part, keyboard shortcuts are not discoverable, like mousing interfaces.  You have to read the manual or the online help.  In the case of SSDS, the poor user has to take a trip to Alberta and visit the SwampShack to learn your program.

    What is the matter with you?

    And who are you to elevate your own personal experience over hundreds or thousands of hours of scientific research?  Tell you what: you find a friend or family member who uses a computer every day, and offer to take away their mouse FOREVER in exchange for $100.  Let's see if they'll take that sweet deal.



  • @CodeSimian said:

    I bet you would like Jared Diamond, despite him being a university professor and all.  He likes the outdoors, like you, and he is very interested in native cultures, like you.

    http://www.amazon.com/Collapse-Societies-Choose-Fail-Succeed/dp/B000IJ7Q32/

    Whoa! Thanks for the link. It sounds fascinating, so I bought it.



  • @WeatherGod said:

    A good book to read would be "The World Without Us".  This guy actually would agree with you.  What is most important is that the environment will recover.

    Added to wish list!



  • @CodeSimian said:

    And who are you to elevate your own personal experience over hundreds or thousands of hours of scientific research?  Tell you what: you find a friend or family member who uses a computer every day, and offer to take away their mouse FOREVER in exchange for $100.  Let's see if they'll take that sweet deal.
     

    Spectate, if you can get a video of 1 family member or friend who uses a computer EVERY DAY and will give up using a mouse FOR THE REST OF HIS LIFE in exchange for $100, I will personally donate the $100.  After all, everybody knows your name and address, so sending the funds will not be a problem.

    I will need a video testimonial as proof. 

    One-time offer.  Take it or leave it.

    Some conditions:

    1) The user must use the computer every day for personal (home) use

    2) The user must not be an expert or worker in the IT field

    3) The user must be using a modern GUI-based operating system (e.g. Windows XP, Vista, Mac OS X, Ubuntu) 

    In other words, the user has to be a member of the MASSES 

    4) The user must agree to never use a mouse again FOR THE REST OF HIS/HER LIFE 



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    @CodeSimian said:

    Common sense tells experienced computer operators like you and me that keyboard shortcuts are faster than using the mouse.  However, scientific research shows that using the mouse is usually faster.  So software developers continue to focus on mouse interfaces

    BS. If you use the keyboard properly it is way faster than any mouse. I'm not talking Ctrl/Alt anything (those keys might just as well be hanging on the wall) having to move you hand from the home position slows you down, big time.. How about jj (enter) for example I can do that way quicker than moving my hand to any mouse. and I can do it while watching TV. If you have never done a keypunch verify program, then you don't know anything about keyboard speed. Nothing nada zilch zero....
    If you had any skill whatsoever, you'd find that the entirety of the keyboard is quickly accessible.  I can type anything on the keyboard while looking away.  Just because you're apparently hunt-and-pecking doesn't mean that touch typing is beyond the grasp of the common man.  Pay attention, man.  The current generation of kids are all going to be vastly more effective with the keyboard than your generation or mine, simply by the ubiquitous nature of computers today.


  • @CodeSimian said:

    @CodeSimian said:

    And who are you to elevate your own personal experience over hundreds or thousands of hours of scientific research?  Tell you what: you find a friend or family member who uses a computer every day, and offer to take away their mouse FOREVER in exchange for $100.  Let's see if they'll take that sweet deal.
     

    Spectate, if you can get a video of 1 family member or friend who uses a computer EVERY DAY and will give up using a mouse FOR THE REST OF HIS LIFE in exchange for $100, I will personally donate the $100.  After all, everybody knows your name and address, so sending the funds will not be a problem.

    I will need a video testimonial as proof. 

    One-time offer.  Take it or leave it.

    Some conditions:

    1) The user must use the computer every day for personal (home) use

    2) The user must not be an expert or worker in the IT field

    3) The user must be using a modern GUI-based operating system (e.g. Windows XP, Vista, Mac OS X, Ubuntu) 

    In other words, the user has to be a member of the MASSES 

    4) The user must agree to never use a mouse again FOR THE REST OF HIS/HER LIFE 

     

    How about just a video testimonial of someone nearby after using SSDS for the first time?



  • @bstorer said:

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    @CodeSimian said:

    Common sense tells experienced computer operators like you and me that keyboard shortcuts are faster than using the mouse.  However, scientific research shows that using the mouse is usually faster.  So software developers continue to focus on mouse interfaces

    BS. If you use the keyboard properly it is way faster than any mouse. I'm not talking Ctrl/Alt anything (those keys might just as well be hanging on the wall) having to move you hand from the home position slows you down, big time.. How about jj (enter) for example I can do that way quicker than moving my hand to any mouse. and I can do it while watching TV. If you have never done a keypunch verify program, then you don't know anything about keyboard speed. Nothing nada zilch zero....

    If you had any skill whatsoever, you'd find that the entirety of the keyboard is quickly accessible.  I can type anything on the keyboard while looking away.  Just because you're apparently hunt-and-pecking doesn't mean that touch typing is beyond the grasp of the common man.  Pay attention, man.  The current generation of kids are all going to be vastly more effective with the keyboard than your generation or mine, simply by the ubiquitous nature of computers today.
     

    I guess that is what Spectate meant in the other thread  when he said SSDS shortcuts are far faster than keyboard "SlowCuts".  Once again, excellent communication skills save the day!

    Change is scary when you are old and obsolete, huh Spectate? 



  • @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    If you have time to do this kind of stuff, then by all means, please volunteer
    your time and help out.

    As I said before, the pages are almost valid, and I already highlighted most of the mistakes. You understand I cannot change the pages myself.

    @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    The only JS stuff on the site is the google analytics. Anything else could only
    be explained by ASP.NET framework stuff still appearing. I doubt that
    though. 

    This is from Quotes.aspx:

    [code]
    <input type="hidden" name="__VIEWSTATE" id="__VIEWSTATE" value="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/>
    <input type="hidden" name="__EVENTTARGET" id="__EVENTTARGET" value="" />
    <input type="hidden" name="__EVENTARGUMENT" id="__EVENTARGUMENT" value="" />
    
    <script type="text/javascript">
    
    </script>
    

    [/code]

    Not that it bothers me too much, but it doesn't serve much purpose, either.

    @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    P.S. Why does it matter? Really?

    On my monitor, approximately half of the space is wasted. Not nice.

    Maybe I'll look into stylesheets, but I'm not a web design person.

    @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    What is the consensus?

    I like the old one more, it's more recognizable. What do you think about the transparency stuff I said above?



  • @Spectre said:

    As I said before, the pages are almost valid, andI already highlighted most of the mistakes. You understand I cannot change the pages myself.
     

    No, but as I have said many times, I don't have much time, but I would be happy to give volunteers access in one way or the other.

     @Spectre said:

    Not that it bothers me too much, but it doesn't serve much purpose, either.

     This is a databound page with ASP.NET controls on it. Do you think I sit there and write that kind of JS for no reason?

    @Spectre said:

    On my monitor, approximately half of the space is wasted. Not nice.

    Looks fine on all the setups I have seen it on. I would be fine with full size. But not exactly anywhere near the top of my list at the moment.

    @Spectre said:

    What do you think about the transparency stuff I said above?

    Make it. I will put it up if it looks ok.

    (You may have done this already, but that hosting link you provided before seemed horribly broken. )



  • @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    [quote user="Spectre"]And, more importantly, why is the layout fixed-width?

    I cannot figure out how that is important at all, least of all 'most important' but feel free to volunteer your time to improve the site's aesthetics.

     

    P.S. Why does it matter? Really?

    [/quote] On my regular computer over half the screen is wasted. And it looks like this on the handheld I'm using right now:
    [URL=http://img441.imageshack.us/my.php?image=capture07042008115839sy0.png][IMG]http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/8450/capture07042008115839sy0.th.png[/IMG][/URL]


  • @joemck said:

    On my regular computer over half the screen is wasted. And it looks like this on the handheld I'm using right now

    Obviously it needs design work. He's asked for help, so offer up a stylesheet!



  • @CodeSimian said:

    Spectate, if you can get a video of 1 family member or friend who uses a computer EVERY DAY and will give up using a mouse FOR THE REST OF HIS LIFE in exchange for $100

    One more condition, Spectate: you have 1 week to find this person and submit a suitable video testimonial, where he or she explains his job (must be non-IT), how he uses his computer (every day for personal use), and promises to stop using a mouse forever.  If I don't see this video by Monday, April 14, 2008, I'll assume you saw the light and realized that mice and mouse interfaces are good for something, too.

     



  •  @AbbydonKrafts said:

    @joemck said:
    On my regular computer over half the screen is wasted. And it looks like this on the handheld I'm using right now

    Obviously it needs design work. He's asked for help, so offer up a stylesheet!

    I commented out the width element in the style sheet.

    Honestly, I think that looks like hell now, but whatever.  Maybe we should use a percentage to bring back a small but scalable margin? I don't know without hacking at it for a while.

    Obviously the header needs to be fixed for this width now, but I definitely do not have the time at the moment. There is a zip file ready for anyone who thinks they can do better.

    This is the current stylesheet. http://www.thestupidestmanonearth.com/App_Themes/Black/Default.css

    Feel free to hack at it and if you think you have something, I will try it out.

     

    And no, I wasn't the original author of this or any of the layout/aesthetics so I don't care about any WTFs in there. CSS is not my strong point in any way shape or form. If you can make it look good, let's go for it.



  • @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    I don't know without hacking at it for a while.

    That's what it's going to take (hacking at it). If someone else doesn't do it, I may get around to it in the evenings.



  • @CodeSimian said:

    @CodeSimian said:

    Spectate, if you can get a video of 1 family member or friend who uses a computer EVERY DAY and will give up using a mouse FOR THE REST OF HIS LIFE in exchange for $100

    One more condition, Spectate: you have 1 week to find this person and submit a suitable video testimonial, where he or she explains his job (must be non-IT), how he uses his computer (every day for personal use), and promises to stop using a mouse forever.  If I don't see this video by Monday, April 14, 2008, I'll assume you saw the light and realized that mice and mouse interfaces are good for something, too.

     

    That's what he wants: to make money off his crackpot ideas. I wouldn't put it past him to pay some random homeless person $10 to read a script, that's probabally more profit than he's made from selling magic rocks and t-shirts.

     

    Edit: Crap, misread your post and thought you were offering $100, sorry. 



  • @AbbydonKrafts said:

    @MasterPlanSoftware said:
    I don't know without hacking at it for a while.

    That's what it's going to take (hacking at it). If someone else doesn't do it, I may get around to it in the evenings.

     

    Yep I know we have some pretty good design/CSS people around here, so maybe they will want a crack at it, but not me. I would rather spend my time getting the quoting section set up so people can post.



  • @dabean said:

    I wouldn't put it past him to pay some random homeless person $10 to read a script, that's probabally more profit than he's made from selling magic rocks and t-shirts.
     

    And it would increase his current yearly salary by a factor of 10.



  • More (out of context) quotes for the site:

    Spectate is clearly in great physical shape:

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    I wasn't the last into camp but 2nd last. The loser was a blind fellow. I passed him in the final couple hundred yards.

    What exactly was Spectate's job here again?

    @SpectatePimp said:

    I told them let me know when anybody touched one of our girls. I would be down there in an instant. With the right attitude.



  • @dabean said:

    Edit: Crap, misread your post and thought you were offering $100, sorry. 
     

    I am.  But somehow I don't think he'll take me up on that offer.

    If Spectate hired someone to lie for the camera, I guess he would be no better than all the lying, cheating smart guys he hates so much.  I wonder if he'd be able to live with that knowledge.

    I'll make my own judgement call on whether the video is genuine or not. 



  • @CodeSimian said:

    And who are you to elevate your own personal experience over hundreds or thousands of hours of scientific research?  Tell you what: you find a friend or family member who uses a computer every day, and offer to take away their mouse FOREVER in exchange for $100.  Let's see if they'll take that sweet deal.

     

    I'll take that deal and go buy a mouse and pocket the rest. He can keep my original mouse forever.



  • @bstorer said:

    They can have my C-x C-c when they pry it from my cold, dead hands!
    Am I the only one who just can't get used to Ctrl+XCV and uses Shift+Del, Ctrl+Ins and Shift+Ins instead?



  • @ender said:

    Am I the only one who just can't get used to Ctrl+XCV and uses Shift+Del, Ctrl+Ins and Shift+Ins instead?
     

    FFS I hope so.



  • @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    Make it. I will put it up if it looks ok.

    (You may have done this already, but that hosting link you provided before seemed horribly broken. )

    RapidShare isn't broken, but not convenient, either.

    Take two: [img]http://tinypic.ca/files/2p6fk3p5861hkx3kjnb5.ico[/img].



  • @pitchingchris said:

    @CodeSimian said:

    And who are you to elevate your own personal experience over hundreds or thousands of hours of scientific research?  Tell you what: you find a friend or family member who uses a computer every day, and offer to take away their mouse FOREVER in exchange for $100.  Let's see if they'll take that sweet deal.

     

    I'll take that deal and go buy a mouse and pocket the rest. He can keep my original mouse forever.

     

    I already stipulated that:

    • The person has to give up using a mouse for the rest of his/her life
    • The person cannot be an IT professional 


  • @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    @ender said:
    Am I the only one who just can't get used to Ctrl+XCV and uses Shift+Del, Ctrl+Ins and Shift+Ins instead?
     

    FFS I hope so.

    I agree with MPS. In most cases where I copy/paste, I've got my right hand using the mouse to do the selecting, so I want the shortcuts to be left-handed.



  • @Spectre said:

    @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    Make it. I will put it up if it looks ok.

    (You may have done this already, but that hosting link you provided before seemed horribly broken. )

    RapidShare isn't broken, but not convenient, either.

    Take two: .

     

    Changed. Feedback?



  • @CodeSimian said:

    IT professional 
     

    How about an IT unprofessional?

    Flip flops, hasn't showered in a week look, reeks like beer and pot...

    Holy shit! It is Spectate!



  • @ender said:

    Am I the only one who just can't get used to Ctrl+XCV and uses Shift+Del, Ctrl+Ins and Shift+Ins instead?
    Depends, I use Shift-Del a lot when using Shift to highlight text.  If I highlight with the mouse, I'll probably use Ctrl-X.



  • @ender said:

    Am I the only one who just can't get used to Ctrl+XCV and uses Shift+Del, Ctrl+Ins and Shift+Ins instead?

    Nope. I use those all the time still because I used them for so many years in DOS. The only time I use the CTRL+X/C/V is when the application uses special data and doesn't respond to the SHIFT ones.



  •  @CodeSimian said:

    @dabean said:

    Edit: Crap, misread your post and thought you were offering $100, sorry. 
     

    I am.

    Hah, I blame the flu meds for that one. Then again, it might be a curse ;)

    I really think this is a (misguided) marketing attempt. The story as I see it so far:

    Swampy lives a mediocre life doing menial jobs and winds up working at a gravel pit. A stone pops out of the crusher one day, so (having nothing better to do) he decides to pick it up. It's not your average stone (having a hole in it and all) and he keeps it. Sometime later, probably after a few 'tokes', he decides the stone may actually be worth something, since he's never seen a stone with a hole in it.

    Cue some Swamp-style research, and he has his 'Medicine Stone". It's his ticket to fame, and he throws everything he has behind it. He's met with ridicule, but a friend of his tells him that the media exposure he's had is worth $2,000,000 a day. Swampy of course decides that figure should be directly translatable to cash in his pocket, so decides to sell medicine stone memorabilia. *Insert another crackpot idea*, rinse, repeat.

    I think at some point the line between 'easy money scam' and 'genuine belief' has been crossed, but it's very blurry. He's definitely taken the 'no publicity is bad publicity' advice to heart given his attitude. Look at that post about how to make money from dinosaur skin, or the title of this very thread.

    I doubt he does anything for the benefit of "the masses".



  • @ender said:

    @bstorer said:
    They can have my C-x C-c when they pry it from my cold, dead hands! 
    Am I the only one who just can't get used to Ctrl+XCV and uses Shift+Del, Ctrl+Ins and Shift+Ins instead?
     

    I think you are old?

    I got the inverse thing happening to me when I first had to work with turbopascal/turboC, thankfully I switched to notepad for coding -rather than learning the SHIFT+INS/DEL/etc- 


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