I think we made @CodingHorror mad
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But it's ok, I got around his block when linking to
http://what.thedailywtf.com/t/licence-what-licence-all-your-links-are-belong-to-us/1425
by just adding an a href.
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Bug report: not being able to link to TDWTF is a barrier to reading TDWTF.
Proposed fix: Add a new category to meta.discourse.org that links to all topics on TDWTF.
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https://meta.discourse.org/t/compliance-with-eu-cookie-law/17727/3?u=matches
For the record, please don't go spamming his forum related to this. It's his business to succeed or fail, I've provided the link to the relevant discussion on (our) side.
Actually, I'm going to save this as an image so that just in case somehow these posts get rebaked, this information can live on forever.
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This post is deleted!
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But it's ok, I got around his block when linking to
http://what.thedailywtf.com/t/licence-what-licence-all-your-links-are-belong-to-us/1425
ROTFL. Jeff is blocking links to TDWTF? +1000, that post made my day!
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I couldn't help myself:
https://meta.discourse.org/t/compliance-with-eu-cookie-law/17727/4?u=abarker
And in case of deletion:
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I'm sure @Nagesh would find this interesting.
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Checking random big sites:
microsoft.com complies
apple.com does not.
ubuntu.com complies.
ebay.com does not, but ebay.co.uk does.Addendum:
Amazon does have a link to cookie policy, missed it due to not being a notification bar like I'm used to. It's in the footer.
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I have run into the same matter with other entities, that because they're not based in the EU, the rules don't apply. Maybe not - the EU rules don't necessarily apply to a US server - but they WILL apply if any customers are based in the EU.
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does apple.co.uk?
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https://meta.discourse.org/t/compliance-with-eu-cookie-law/17727/3?u=matches
Actually, I'm going to save this as an image so that just in case somehow these posts get rebaked, this information can live on forever.
Actually, I think he thinks he is right. For Jeff, checking something like that would go like:- access Amazon
- check cookie
- compare against EU legislation
- completely not getting that he's not acceessing Amazon from EU
- Post opinion
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I have to ask, what constitutes complying? Is it just telling people "hey, we use cookies" and what they're used for, or is it something more in-depth?
Filed under: [I would try to look but every site I can find that really talks about it is based outside the US and generally blocked by my work's firewall.](#tag2), [And my phone is almost dead, so I'm not looking from it.](#tag2)
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does apple.co.uk?
I actually checked but forgot to mention: nope, Apple cares not for the law.
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Actually, I think he thinks he is right. For Jeff, checking something like that would go like:
- access Amazon
- check cookie
- compare against EU legislation
- completely not getting that he's not acceessing Amazon from EU
- Post opinion
This is most likely accurate.
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Having seen a similar bar thing on a bunch of sites lately I'm going to make a buttumption that it's all you need to do.
There is always a link that provides more info on cookies in general and explanation of third-party cookies (which are the primary reason for the law AFAIK).
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Ok, so, yeah, Jeff is full of shit.
I looked at Amazon France (work firewall seems to have some holes), and saw a thing on the front page where it said they use cookies, and a link to a page where they explain why they collect them. I'm sure if I checked the other EU country versions of Amazon, I'd see the same.
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It depends which EU country you're in because each country implemented it slightly differently.
In the UK there are some weird clauses that mean you can even get away with it if it's just session cookies that are 'fundamentally necessary' e.g. a shopping cart. But yeah, you're supposed to ask permission before storing any cookies, and indicate consent with such a cookie, and provide a list of all cookies that may be set, including what they are used for.
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You're only just figuring out now that Jeff is full of shit?
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No, it's just proof he's not less full of it.
Case in point, I don't know about the law as a whole, so I ask people who might know and look and see. What Jeff seems to do is read something, think he knows, spouts out crap, then tries to back it up with tenuous-at-best anecdotal evidence.
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Wanted to call "no repro" but I did find it in the footer. I'm used to the popup bar thing so I didn't try checking the footer originally.
I amended my post above to reflect this.
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Don't forget that most companies also have a EU base. Most likely just to obtain an Irish-Dutch Sandwich but never the less ... it is the same for fysical products. If you are targeting an EU citizens as customers with your product, marketing, availability, ... you should comply with relevant EU rules (think electronic safty and such).
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That shouldn't come as a surprise Apple also doesn't care for EU warranty rules.
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But that's Jeff's entire MO. It's how he contrived StackOverflow and co. It's how he arrived at Discourse and everything on his blog just provides the evidence.
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From what I can see, every version of Amazon based in an EU country (desktop view) has, at the top right something saying they use cookies, and the link for more information.
Every version of Amazon I can see has the link at the bottom, but only the EU based ones also say it in the top right (Amazon.com is the US one, so it won't show that link and isn't beholden to the EU law).
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There is a cookie link on the bottom of the apple page, does that qualify?
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That shouldn't come as a surprise Apple also doesn't care for EU warranty rules.
Maybe EU used rounded corners somewhere and now they are pissed?
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Having seen a similar bar thing on a bunch of sites lately I'm going to make a buttumption that it's all you need to do.
Idd. the dutch where first. I started appearing on dutch sites early this year I think but now I'm seeing these all over the place.
I would also think that EU would accept if it is done for amazon.co.uk but not for amazon.com, after all the rest of the site will be targeting a specific region.
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There is a cookie link on the bottom of the apple page, does that qualify?
Possibly. As I said, I saw it as a popup bar thing all over the place so I instinctively looked for that. IANAL but I guess a link is fine in any case. I doubt the law specifies it has to be contained in a floating
<div>.
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I don't see 'float' in the div attributes of that page, but here's a screenshot comparison of apple.com and apple.co.uk
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. I doubt the law specifies it has to be contained in a floating <div>.
I doubt the law makers understand floating let all a div
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Pedantic dickweedery is getting rampant here. Everyone gunning for a badge?
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but here's a screenshot comparison of apple.com and apple.co.uk
So there is a link. Beeing Apple I can contrive them to say: well everybody does it like that but we can get away by just putting a link in the footer.
If I remember the Dutch example well it was clear that the user had to give its actual consent. Thus the floating div with accept button contraption. It was not enough to just have an explanation of your cookie use in your TOS.
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If I remember the Dutch example well it was clear that the user had to give its actual consent. Thus the floating div with accept button contraption. It was not enough to just have an explanation of your cookie use in your TOS.
That's what I'm mostly seeing. They don't exactly throw a modal dialog at you, but the bar is distracting enough to draw your attention and look for a way to get rid of it.
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What's the local domain for those areas? .NL?
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Apple appears to redirect those to "apple.com/XX", e.g. "apple.com/nl/"
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Yes, or rather it where simply dutch sites. I'm fairly certain sites in Dutch are mainly targetting the Netherlands, a part of Belgium and maybe Suriname. So even if they use another .-extension they are run by Dutch companies targetting Dutch audiences.I remeber a dutch tech site ending with .net also doing it.
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Do those domains have the explicit opt in thing for cookies in place? (It might be about targeting at a local level rather than the global)
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Having seen a similar bar thing on a bunch of sites lately I'm going to make a buttumption that it's all you need to do.
It's actually insufficient. You're not allowed to set any cookies (except session) before the visitor explicitly agrees, and additionally, you need to have a page that describes all cookies that can be set, what they do, for how long they can be stored, and possibly have options to opt-out from some of them. A real PITA to implement.
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I stand corrected then. Thank $DEITY I don't have to deal with public facing shit.
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I'm sure if I checked the other EU country versions of Amazon, I'd see the same.
Confirm for Amazon.de, "uses cookies" declaration is in the top right quadrant, beneath the shoppingcart. Including a link "what are cookies?"
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Huh. That's weird.
Computers, Monitors & Technology Solutions | Dell UK
Dell provides technology solutions, services & support. Buy Laptops, Touch Screen PCs, Desktops, Servers, Storage, Monitors, Gaming & Accessories
At the bottom click 'manage cookies' which links to http://www.dell.com/ensighten
Then watch as it goes to http://www.dell.com
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Can I just have a badge that says 'I find bugs' lol
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the EU rules don't necessarily apply to a US server - but they WILL apply if any customers are based in the EU.
INAL, but I think, just as in VAT and sales tax collection you'd need to prove a physical nexus exists for it to apply. If I run a web store w/ a server in the US and sell to you in the UK, you'd be responsible for the VAT and tariffs as I don't have a nexus in the UK.
Regardless, it's not a very onerous requirement either way.
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I don't see 'float' in the div attributes of that page, but here's a screenshot comparison of apple.com and apple.co.uk
Confirm for Apple.de - cookie declaration in same place as at Apple.co.uk
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Regardless, it's not a very onerous requirement either way.
I stand corrected:
@ender said:You're not allowed…, you need to have... A real PITA to implement.
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I did end up checking many EU versions and saw that on all of them. I just didn't report back because I got off work.
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It seems like the general consensus of 'big companies' based on snooping around is 'Provide an explicit link for what cookies are and how they are used, with variations of describing all cookies' but rarely if ever is there any type of pop up for explicit consent requested.
