@Yamikuronue said in Game Categories:
The player is given all information about their role; there are no hidden powers
A couple other ideas that I've been tossing around:
MafiaScum requires all their GMs to have experience playing on their site before GMing. Sufficient experience playing elsewhere may be considered as a substitute, but it is generally considered a good idea to have experience with the local game culture first. Now that we are several games deep and we have a bunch of regulars, do we want to institute something like that?
I'd like to propose that anyone running their first game runs the setup by either an experienced GM or a dedicated Club-Deder to get help identifying the correct categorization and to check for a good balance. This rule would also kick in if an experienced GM is waffling about the categorization of their game.
Since the original topic for this was more focused on the first game, [PBP]Release! Mafia, Let's try this again.
This topic is for threads related to playing games of Mafia, Scum, Werewolves, and other related games. If you wish to GM a game, please join the queue.
@raceprouk said in GM/Game Queue:
@perverted_vixen You mean you don't want to run XXX Mafia?
nah. i like my sexy to have a story and a purpose beyond "we're just gong to bang in a way intended to arouse and satisfy the watcher more than it is intended to arouse and satisfy ourselves and our partner(s)."
so no Mafia XXX for me, i'll do Mafia 69 instead.
There is a Backups Game starting Monday that i'll be playing in if anyone wants to spectate/commentate. I'll be leaving the group for people who are not abarker right after I move this thread back out into the open
then you should be able to copy & paste crawler.js and model.js
model.saveGame('name', [array with thread ids])
.then( game => crawler.crawlGame(game))
(altough i may have made it to need some kind of config info. i really need to reread that code)
@abarker said in TDWTF Mafia revival, attempt #1:
it'd definitely be limited to lunches and after hours.
It's still better than the average player at the moment, so I'll take it. When does your probation period end?
President @RaceProUK and Chancellor @wharrgarbl have enacted the following policy:
Chancellor @wharrgarbl uses his first act with the latest policy to appoint a new chairman for the military and give him the power to stop the uprising outside: @Maciejasjmj.
After the military has the situation under control, however, Hitler refuses to give up his seat. He declares @RaceProUK, @Weng, and @sloosecannon traitors to the German people and has them executed. Fascism has conquered Germany.
Thank you for playing Secret Hitler Mk. II
The "I Like Ike" award goes to @Maciejasjmj for only getting one "Nein" vote in the terms he was elected as President.
The "This is Fine" award goes to @Vault_Dweller for always voting "Ja!"... well, at least until he was murdered.
The MVP award somehow goes to @wharrgarbl for confusing the Liberals so much that they elected him.
The "TR " award goes to @wharrgarbl because, seriously,
(Are you serious there's a MAXIMUM post size ugh)
The thread kind of goes quiet for a bit, as people seem to be busy and only make shorter posts. A lot of snark. Voe picks back up in post 234 with his sights set on DP:
Your open town read on me (more like town suspicion given the lack of solid evidence) has caught me completely by surprise. I didn't address you much because, hey, I have a feeling I've alienated a few people already. Was your support of me a form of fishing for a reaction? See whether I play on your reassurance and try to make bold moves backed by a false sense of confidence? I come from a very paranoid forum and this is what I think immediately when people become supportive.
Interestingly, two posts later he adds:
That, or a scum looking for friends. It's easy to claim someone town when you know they are, indeed, town.
Braided pain adds some fuel to the fire:
Dp101 is kind of dropping in terms of content, makes me uneasy.
Zara and Yraelz both read Maciej as town. Nobody seems to be commenting on Zone at this point. So they have one scum with some pressure on him, one with anti-pressure, and one neutral.
BP asks DP:
gun to your head, who would you want dead right now?
And he replies:
Lex probably, his attempts to criticise other people for playing the game their way still feels wrong to me. Not sure who after that, I'm bad at D1
He also replies to Voe's criticism:
I don't do reaction testing, it was a genuine read. You have been very open in your posts and motives, and obviously town to me.
and claims to have been at school during the earlier spat of activity. The 24-hour remaining mark comes on day one, and the votes are one apiece on lexi, TEOL, Zara, Yraelz, Crisp, and Celever. If any of that shade on DP had been backed by a vote, they might be worried by now, but so far it's just suspicion the scum team is willing to let die away naturally as the day progresses. DP backs out his earlier accusation of lexi:
Speaking of townreads, Lex is moderately towny to me. I disagree with his interpretation of TEOL, but other than that, the post seems solid.
But nobody notices the reversal. Instead, they discuss how to play town: what to do, what not to do. The scum all stay quiet during this discussion, probably taking notes. When MAciej does come back in, in post 297, it's with a list of reads: muchando gets scum points for being so quiet, and pele gets a scum read for telling people to calm down (ages ago). Voe gets eased up to a null read, and overall, he has basically no read but a lot to say about it.
Murska says DP and he think alike, as well as he and Zone, which is promising for the scum team. Later, he posts his total list: all three scum are in the top bracket of towniness.
Yraelz, on the other hand, says he is "very interested" in lynching Zone for saying, well, nothing at all:
Zone has 5 posts in which he consistently conveys the ideas that he is either (a) a new player or (b) not particularly good at this game. I believe that these posts come from a player sided with the mafia. Why? Because mafia players have a vested interest in the town not being able to read them well. From that viewpoint it makes considerable sense to portray oneself as either a newb or prone to making mistakes. Both portrayals act as defense against scum-slips and scummy posting.
I have watched multiple newer players on DDO post these same types of arguments when mafia aligned. In those instances it seemed that the posts were more a subconscious reaction to being mafia rather than an active strategy to avoid being read. Thus, I consider this to be a strong scum slip from newer players.
Additionally, in reading Zone's posts I get the overwhelming impression that Zone is posting for the sake of posting. I see very little pro-town utility to those posts.
He has Zone dead to rights here. Murska goes to read an old game of Zone's to get more of a feel for his playstyle, and Yraelz asks Zara if they agree with the read. DP buddies up to Murska for his readlist, while TEOL and Murska get into a long argument. Murska's analysis of Zone comes back with him reading the same as in the previous game, and Zara cautioning that if he is a new player, he'll not have developed much of a meta yet. Yraelz backs down based on Zone's claimed new-ness.
Yraelz then continues shooting himself in the foot by voting Nocturne as scum; he reads DP and Maciej as strong town, and Zone, lexi, and Nocturne as scum. He outright asks DP and Maciej (among others) to help him pressure Nocturne for the answers to some questions he didn't get before. DP worries about being so early on the lynch wagon and posts:
I'm not sure that pressure via votes is really necessary in his case, he's been decently active.
Nocturne has the worst excuse ever:
I know this is a really lame excuse but I'm in a game of league of legends and I'd like to win. I'm up to date with the thread and will get around to answering roughly 40 mins from now, please be on for realtime
Yraelz has his sights on Nocturne mostly because he went from agreeing with Voe to wanting to lynch Voe over the course of a few posts, and because he doesn't think Zara is too scummy but votes anyway to get a good read on them by presenting pressure. Again, Nocturne is a poor player, but not objectively scummy here. But Yraelz goes after him anyway, while the scum .
DP follows, voting. Nocturne keeps making weird statements like:
I don't like being the one to start the wagon, sometimes because it gets me lynched, sometimes because it doesn't gain traction. I still think right now my vote is supposed to be on zara until other people start voting for voe
and DP helps Yraelz question him:
But if you think that someone is scum, why shouldn't you vote for them immediately? Why should others have to start voting for someone first before you make your move? I don't understand your perspective.
Murska comes on and votes Nocturne as well, and Yraelz sums up his case:
In post #328 Nocturne identifies Zarathustra as a town read and simultaneously votes for Zarathustra. When later asked to clarify he says that he would like to see how Zara acts under pressure and also what Zara's flip is (#352). This however seems at odds with the present state of the game where (a) Zarathustra has already been the most pressured player and (b) Nocturne previously identified three other players as scummy. In fact, Nocturne is very explicit about his desire to lynch Voe just a few posts later:
In post #328 Nocturne posts four points regarding Voe which I documented sequentially here: #360. At first glance these appear to be a number of reasons to townread Voe followed by an unjustified scum read. When questioned Nocturne says that the text where he liked Voe is actually the justification for Voe being scum because liking Voe doesn't align with Voe's background profile (#367). He later clarifies that Voe seems "sane" which contradicts the background profile (#371). Even ignoring the logical fallacy (Voe must mimic his background profile) this seems like a stretch to me because (a) Nocturne explicitly said he liked Voe's play in #328 and (b) Voe's profile actually indicates that he occasionally has "great intuition".
Finally, in post #328, Nocturne articulates that:
Quote Originally Posted by [NSM] Nocturne on May 16, 2017, 7:51 PM (#328)
I'm just quoting all of Voe's stuff because I'd actually like to start a wagon on him.
Yet, in voting for Zarathustra he makes no attempt to start a wagon. Later, under pressure, he switches his vote to Voe but then makes no further effort to get people to join the wagon (#363). Both of these suggest that Nocturne's quoted sentiment was fabricated. I provided an opening for Nocturne to convince me that he was interested in starting a wagon [...] but no real attempt was made. Later, Nocturne clarifies that he didn't actually want to start a wagon but rather:
I'd rather provide what I think and let a more aggressive player push the lynch.
and he only initially said he did:
So that people know I want to wagon him [Voe]
These things again sound somewhat plausible, but they breakdown when re-examining post #328 and beyond. Nowhere in the post does Nocturne ever try to convince people to start a wagon. And he provides no information that would allow other players to begin a wagon. Nocturne contends that he did provide said information.
I frankly don't believe Nocturne. If Nocturne wanted to either lead a lynch or provide players with information for them to lead a lynch then he would have taken action to do those things. He had ample opportunity to ping other players for wagon votes, to lay out any semblance of a case against Voe, or even to push Voe himself. The complete lack of action followed by the winding road of justifications (which still aren't substantiated by actions) indicates that the sentiments are fabricated.
In hindsight, with Nocturne as a town player, this is just... bad play. It could have been scum trying to emulate a poor town player, but it was actually just a poor town player.
DP starts to distance himself a little as the votes come rolling in:
Nocturne: Probably wins the prize for second-weirdest player after Lex, and has not had very coherant posts. Reads change as they are posted, but not with any clear progression within the post, and their ideas surrounding voting on wagons that others start rather than starting them themselves just doesn't make any sense at all. Decent chance of being scum, with a small chance of out-of-control townie tripping over themselves.
While Maciej hops onboard:
That's pretty much the part at which I started strongly agreeing with going against Nocturne - it looks uncomfortably like pandering to the audience. It's a huge red flag when you start doing things just to have people get off your case - stepping back is fine, we all make mistakes, but openly admitting you're doing something you're not agreeing with smells of survival concern to me.
The entire case against Voe is just bizarre coming from Nocturne, and it's starting to make me reevaluate my position on him the exact other way. I think I get the gist of it - Nocturne doesn't have any issues with Voe, and Voe paints himself as a rather harsh and unlikable player when town, so that must mean he's scum in this game - but that's really not an argument you can honestly make based on just a bio. And either way it's not a real argument - I, for example, definitely don't like Voe's play and he does come off as unlikable to me, so even if we accept that logic that still doesn't prove his scumminess.
I agree with the case, maybe not with Yraelz exact points, but looking into Nocturne's responses there's something off about him. The bad reads that flip-flop in the span of one post aren't that much of an issue by themselves, but there's a really bad response to pressure on Nocturne's part and the unwillingness to push a wagon, both strong scum smells.
Zone doesn't vote, but does post another wall, explaining that in his home site, nobody volunteered, so he volunteered, but he's not a great player. Crips reads him town for that:
zone is fine. He actually tried helping town and being limited on means doesn't look like an excuse. If i looked at it with external perspective, he's ten times townier than me. In fact, i don't get Yraelz' vote on him, even if for pressure purposes.
and admits to not really reading his ISO well:
while reading his stuff i found myself caught into his adventures to find his phone and i forgot to focus on his ingame behavior. The case against him is pretty convincing, especially since i had no position on anyone until just an hour ago. Too bad it came right after he went to sleep, though. Maybe it wouldn't have changed anything but i'd have loved to see a reply.
Nocturne freaks out in a very Town way:
ugh holy crap guys DON'T LYNCH ME
this is so freakin dumb, it happens every time and I'm sick of it
Yraelz, you make a good point against me, but the problem is it's not true BECAUSE I'M TOWN.
dp, I don't think I'm tripping over myself, I think you guys are taking what I say and trying to twist it into a scenario where I'm a wolf.
Plus, since I likely won't have contact during work today since I didn't end up finding my phone, I think it's a bit unfair to lynch someone who won't be around until end of day. If I'm not allowed to pressure zara because he was already pressured, then I'm leaving my vote on Voe. If you guys MUST kill me, do it like on the weekend or something smh
atm I don't think there are any wolves on my wagon fwiw
I swear guys whatever you're scum reading me for it's encompassed in my town game 100%
At this point there's a wagon of six votes on him, with the second-most being 2 votes. Both DP and Maciej are on the wagon. Pele points out:
I swear guys whatever you're scum reading me for it's encompassed in my town game 100%
which DP uses to throw shade on him:
Why a tie? The process of making one just sounds like it'll give scum an opportunity to swap wagons without any suspicion being generated, and any information gleaned from the tiebreaker would probably be minimal.
To which he explains you learn more that way, and also, he doesn't mean literally make a tie so it becomes random, just find the second-scummiest person.
DP backs down from his case right away. Maciej meanwhile tries to back it up:
If you think Nocturne is scum, why would you drag out another wagon just for the sake of having another wagon and risk the scum pushing it? And if you think Nocturne is town, why not want everybody to vote for someone else?
Not only would you need to actually pick right so that you have a scum and a townie, not only would you need to be sure that the player who didn't get lynched is actually scum and not just another town, but you'd also likely have about 5-6 people on the town wagon. That's way more than there are scum.
But then turns around and asks,
Who would you like to see as the second bandwagon?
As if it's a good idea now as well.
Zone votes for lexi so that he has a vote out there at end of day without being on the same wagon as his scumpartners. Voe, with his talk earlier about how the way you phrase things doesn't lie, says that Nocturne is losing his shit and that makes him scummy, and votes. With the wagon pretty much unstoppable, the scum get quieter; Zone vanishes along his usual pattern, but while Maciej talks to Zara some and Pele some, he doesn't seem to advocate much, and DP pretty much vanishes.
MAciej was asked for his top townreads, and he replies:
I rarely have conclusive town reads. If I had to pick two people I trust the most right now, I'd likely go with @braided pain and @Yraelz, for mostly the same reasons - I like their strategy, I like them asking people questions and pushing the discussion forward, and I haven't found anything malicious in what they're saying yet despite both generating plenty of content. All in all I get similar, investigatory vibes from them, and more investigation is always good.
Yraelz mistakes activity for scumminess:
A townie, in Nocturne's position, would want to fight against the injustice of being mislynched. Instead Nocturne posts the equivalent of "no it's not me!" [#422][#423][#425] and then never comes back. This occurs despite me fishing Nocturne for information that he could use to clear himself [#472]. I think that Nocturne probably isn't fighting against the lynch because he doesn't perceive it as an injustice. Rather, he knows the lynch conclusion is correct and feels that there is no way to escape it.
At that point though, they knew the day was over. They started discussing the night kill, for example. There's no majority-lynch day one in this game or it'd hav been over right then, with 7 of 15 players voting for Nocturne. Instead it limps along until time is up, with a final total of 8 votes on Nocturne and 3 on pele.
@Yamikuronue said in Mafia - voting analysis:
@wharrgarbl said in Mafia - voting analysis:
Someday we risk having to anonymize the players to keep going
Yeah, I'm starting to consider your approach - find somewhere else to play.
@izzion said in Mafia Championship: Your Community Is Invited!:
I mean, technically, being assigned as mafia does involve some luck
He'll figure out a way to get a power role and burn people, even in a vanilla game.
Yes, still bitter.
@Jaloopa said in Forum Mafia - Club Ded:
You were acting pretty scummy but not at all out of character
I tried my best to look at every thought objectively.
"This idea makes sense only if this."
"Are you trying to say THIS!?!?!"
"OH NOES, you're giving bad advice. You're scum!!!"
Best Mafia-related Quotes Thread
Quote your favorite amusing moments here.
To start us off, here's some of the top voted posts from our Mafia games:
Snark about the metagame
@Yamikuronue said in Club Ded Mafia III and post-discussion:
@Maciejasjmj said:We have a metagame? Why don't you tell us more...
For example, everyone knows to kill you and abarker first if they don't want to sit through walls of text
@Yamikuronue said in Mafia 4: The maffening: question:
@Maciejasjmj said:take the tactics with a pinch of salt
...lest you go full Xaade on day 1
@Jaloopa said in Pinky Promise Mafia - Signups Open!:
@Maciejasjmj said in Pinky Promise Mafia - Signups Open!:
Isn't the game balanced enough towards a town win already?
With our record a single Mafia with no night kill and a rule that they have to say "I AM MAFIA" at least once a day isn't balanced enough toward a town win
@PleegWat said in Club Ded Mafia III and post-discussion:
On TDWTF, we could start a mafia game with only town players, and they'd still manage to lose.
Snark about specific games
@Onyx said in [PBP] Release! Mafia:
Your action to block swayde was successfully submitted. And it would have stopped the Mafia kill, had not they switched to Placeholder at the last second.
You can't really think about this though, as you're a bit blindsided by Maciej burning you alive...
You are dead.
Worst. PM. Ever.
@Yamikuronue said in Pinky Promise Mafia - Signups Open!:
@accalia said in Pinky Promise Mafia - Signups Open!:
Threats of what you'll do to me if i play a bastard game even though i pinky promised it wouldn't be a bastard game?
My bedroom floor gets cold in the mornings. A nice, freshly tanned foxskin hide would liven the place up and keep my frigid toes a little warmer.
@Maciejasjmj said in Mafia IV: Reverse Mafia - Club Ded and Post Game Discussion:
@fbmac said:Did anyone notice that when I finally gave up waiting for someone to finish @Yamikuronue and switching to @DoctorJones, @tsaukpaetra switched at the same time?
Given that you switched approximately 253 times per day, my guess is "no".
@Maciejasjmj said in Club Ded Mafia III and post-discussion:
@abarker said:I agree, but the town doesn't trust @fbmac enough to go that route.
They don't seem to think he's mafia that much, they're just pissed off at him.
Signs You've Screwed Up #2: when a cop who's investigated you as innocent votes you anyway.
@Maciejasjmj said in Mafia V - Corporate Mafia Club Ded:
@Captain said in Mafia V - Corporate Mafia Club Ded:
@boomzilla Yeah, but I'm not a peer pressure kind of person.
Pro tip: when your peers are out to murder you, sometimes it's good to succumb to peer pressure.
@Yamikuronue said in Mafia IV: Reverse Mafia - Club Ded and Post Game Discussion:
@Sentenryu said:Yami has been claiming since her first post and no one picked on it.
She's the one doing most of the roleplay
Thank you, thank you, I'll be here all night. Because I'm dead.
@Weng said in Mafia 8 - Club Ded:
Why do my games always have big elaborate explosions?
Am I Michael Bay?
@Yamikuronue said in Mafia: Tips and Tricks:
@abarker said:Suicide is not the way out of a difficult [...] situation
Also, protip for life.
@Yamikuronue said in Mafia IV: Reverse Mafia - Club Ded and Post Game Discussion:
By the way, in case anyone was wondering, I had 0 clue my husband was scum. Apparently I gave him a heart attack joking about it a few times too
@abarker said in Mafia V - Corporate Mafia Club Ded:
Here, @abarker, I'll keep you safe tonight.
Cool, I'll just watch some anime here in my cube. Friends?
@fbmac uses LYNCHWAGON! It's super effective!
Special Ben_Lubar Appreciation Award
@Weng said in Mafia 8 - Club Ded:
@izzion popcorn button is the single greatest innovation in the history of innovating.
That time Yami wooden-tabled her Resistance app
@RaceProUK said in Mafia XVI - Coptastrophe Mafia Club Ded:
@CreatedToDislikeThis said in Mafia XVI - Coptastrophe Mafia Club Ded:
the previous game (from this one)
was Hitler, not Mafia.
The previous mafia game (from this one)
@RaceProUK Vote registered
@Maciejasjmj Vote Registered
@Jalolopa has been lynched.
Once the conclusion has been reached @Maciejasjmj pulls his service pistol and shoots @Jaloopa in the face. "Injustice be done" he sneers as he turns his piston on @djls as @RaceProUK guns @Vault_Dweller down
Mafia has won!
Welcome, [Player Name], you are a Cop [Townie|Mafia].
Once per night choose a target, you will attempt to determine the complete role card of your target. If you do not choose a target one will be chosen for you randomly from the current set of living players.
You may self-target.
You are sane.
You win when all threats to the town have been eliminated.
@A_Player said in a PM
confirm/deny/laugh - every investigator, upon night kill, will give us his latest target & result like dangeRuss did
Confirmed. You will get the salient details of the investigation from the deceased point of view.
@Maciejasjmj said in Game Idea Review:
I'd have to run the numbers, but it looks like it wouldn't take that much luck to clear enough town to guarantee victory.
But there's the problem of communicating that to the rest of the town without getting killed at night.
President @djls45 and Chancellor @Jaloopa have enacted the following policy:
The raid on Nazi Germany will commence!
KUNG FURY Official Movie [HD] – [25:04..27:03] 31:03— LaserUnicorns
The Liberal Team Has Won!
Thank you for playing Secret Kung Führer!
http://www.secrethitler.com said in its FAQ:
I don't think there's anything funny or cool about fascism. Who can I complain to?
President-elect Donald J. Trump
725 5th Avenue
New York, NY 10022
If you live in the US, you can also text your address to 520-200-2223 to get contact information for your elected representatives.
And with that, the mob has ruled. Justice will be served, such as it is. @pydsigner pulls out his custom whittled Pipe Pistol, places it against @Vault_Dweller's forehead. @Vault_Dweller has just enough time to spit on @pydsigner's shoe before he pulls the trigger.
As @Vault_Dweller falls to the floor @pydsigner speaks "Mate, why'd you have to do that? 'Twas nothing personal."
The Town Guard move in to clear up the body as everyone turns to the unsavory, but less grisly task of searching through @Vault_Dweller's belongings.
You are a citizen of Bunker Hill with a dark past. A past that has caught up with you. You must collect enough caps in 7 days or less to buy out your dark past and survive into the next week. The only way you can get that many caps is…. Theft. You will have to steal them from the increasingly paranoid shopkeepers.
You are a Tracker! Each night, you may investigate one player in the game and you will discover which player they targeted (if any).
Your sword is your dagger. Once per night you may target a citizen of Bunker Hill and… take everything they have. It's distasteful, but it is the only way….
You win when you have stolen everything you need to pay off your dark past, or when nothing can prevent the same.
... Well. For once, Blind Justice aimed true. That's the last of the thieving scum. Bunker Hill is safe once more. As safe as it's possible to be in the Commonwealth that is.
TOWN HAS WON THE GAME (but you have lost it.)